is there an easer way to do deep

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is there an easer way to do deep

Postby luciddreamer » Thu Apr 11, 2013 6:18 pm

deep physical relaxation in astral dynamics to enter the trance state thats the onley thing iv not been able to do yet.
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is there an easer way to do deep

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Re: is there an easer way to do deep

Postby Xanth » Thu Apr 11, 2013 6:31 pm

I don't quite understand what you're asking/suggesting. :)

Are you saying that you've never been able to do deep relaxation in order to project?
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Re: is there an easer way to do deep

Postby luciddreamer » Thu Apr 11, 2013 6:59 pm

yes sorry thats what i meen as iv onley been able to from a dream
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Re: is there an easer way to do deep

Postby Xanth » Thu Apr 11, 2013 7:36 pm

luciddreamer wrote:yes sorry thats what i meen as iv onley been able to from a dream

Personally, I don't see this as being a problem. The majority of my experiences happen while becoming lucid from within a dream.

But if you want to have more conscious exit projections, you do kind of need to learn to meditate. There's really no way around it. :)
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Re: is there an easer way to do deep

Postby luciddreamer » Fri Apr 12, 2013 5:57 am

cool do you just do the awernes methods in astral dynamics when meditating.thanks
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Re: is there an easer way to do deep

Postby Xanth » Fri Apr 12, 2013 7:43 am

luciddreamer wrote:cool do you just do the awernes methods in astral dynamics when meditating.thanks

The awareness methods in Astral Dynamics?
Do you mean the tactile thing he teaches?

Nope. I mostly just... focus on something to the exclusion of everything else and allow my consciousness to go wherever it wants/needs to. :)
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Re: is there an easer way to do deep

Postby luciddreamer » Fri Apr 12, 2013 7:54 am

cool thanks
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Re: is there an easer way to do deep

Postby Xanth » Fri Apr 12, 2013 8:03 am

Well, that's just what *I* do. I'd call it a bit more advanced.

I'll provide you with something relatively easier later in the day... I just got to work and trying to settle into my morning. :)
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Re: is there an easer way to do deep

Postby CFTraveler » Fri Apr 12, 2013 2:00 pm

Just to clarify, Robert describes deep physical relaxation as in 'body relaxation', and IIRC uses muscle relaxation as one of the methods to achieve it.
The mental relaxation part of it is trance induction methods, which would be any method that uses 'falling' as the 'vehicle'- such as imagining you're a floaty-falling feather, or going down an elevator,etc.

Tactile imaging or visualization is used for various things, but deep physical relaxation is not one of them, unless you use it for that. Which is possible, if you imagine you're getting a massage. That might be physically relaxing, I suppose.

I'm going to guess that alld is saying it's hard to physically relax before mentally relaxing, but I'd like to hear what he really means.
Please and thank you.
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Re: is there an easer way to do deep

Postby Majic » Sat Apr 13, 2013 10:26 pm

I will think of something that moves like a shaft and just imagine this shaft slowing spinning in space in the darkness and then I might add something to it like some bulk of a small bump on one end and it will correct itself and then I might imagine it going faster and it will wobble a little and then change shape and rebalance and so it goes on.
I like this for getting focused and taking me away from WR and the motion seems to relax me and quite often I will go from seeing this in my mind or in the darkness and then be there and I am lucid. It is something I do from time to time to go to a dream state from waking and it is quite effective for me.

Some key points,

Eyelids shut
Eyes looking or observing the darkness
Let the image make itself
Observe it and move eyes along or around
It will change, it always does and just keep observing
A key to the shift about to happen is silence of a phase shift might better describe it and I think this is the change from external senses being used to the mind shifting to the inside viewpoint and you going along with it.

Not quite meditation but effective to lose external awareness
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Re: is there an easer way to do deep

Postby Xanth » Sat Apr 13, 2013 11:33 pm

Well, lately, what's been working for me to get into a deep state is to visualize my consciousness as a drill drilling forward... always pushing forward from my head. As long as I keep focusing on drilling my consciousness (I say forward, but it's actually "within"), it allows me to push everything physical away.
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Re: is there an easer way to do deep

Postby astralzombie » Sun Apr 14, 2013 12:23 am

Xanth wrote:Well, lately, what's been working for me to get into a deep state is to visualize my consciousness as a drill drilling forward... always pushing forward from my head. As long as I keep focusing on drilling my consciousness (I say forward, but it's actually "within"), it allows me to push everything physical away.


I imagine you do have to keep that drill bit facing away from your noggin to be effective. :D

Would you consider this similar to envisioning that we are traveling either forward or up through a tunnel to phase? This gives me vertigo so I abandoned this method as it wasn't necessary. But no harm in broadening my horizons in a manner of speaking.
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Re: is there an easer way to do deep

Postby Xanth » Sun Apr 14, 2013 12:54 am

astralzombie wrote:I imagine you do have to keep that drill bit facing away from your noggin to be effective. :D

I turned it too far inwards once and now I have a hole in my head! *BA DA BUM!* :D

Would you consider this similar to envisioning that we are traveling either forward or up through a tunnel to phase? This gives me vertigo so I abandoned this method as it wasn't necessary. But no harm in broadening my horizons in a manner of speaking.

I don't make that connection personally, but I certainly don't see why you couldn't.
In the end, I find that the concept of "movement" really assists with deepening a meditative state.
Any visualization which includes a good sense of movement always works better for me.
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Re: is there an easer way to do deep

Postby astralzombie » Sun Apr 14, 2013 1:18 am

I turned it too far inwards once and now I have a hole in my head!


Well it no great mystery as to why you are having these new experiences. You've opened your "fourth" eye. *that one's going, going, it's gone. He hit that one out of the ball park, folks*

Pardon the cheese. :D
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Re: is there an easer way to do deep

Postby luciddreamer » Wed Apr 17, 2013 8:05 am

cool i just carnt make that switch from noticing to phazing i get to the npr but i carnt go deeper.
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Re: is there an easer way to do deep

Postby Majic » Wed Apr 17, 2013 1:52 pm

I use a ZEO sleep recorder at times and the shift you are talking about seems to be a drop into light sleep, that is about the point where you awareness or observation of the spot becomes apparent and from here any HI or the start of a slightly more formed up scene accompanied by a lack of noise is a drop into a REM state.

I am very good at getting to that point and now more often that not I think "ahh - almost there" and as you say it kills the moment and brings back some sensory awareness and you need to start again
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Re: is there an easer way to do deep

Postby Xanth » Wed Apr 17, 2013 2:28 pm

Majic wrote:I use a ZEO sleep recorder at times and the shift you are talking about seems to be a drop into light sleep, that is about the point where you awareness or observation of the spot becomes apparent and from here any HI or the start of a slightly more formed up scene accompanied by a lack of noise is a drop into a REM state.

I am very good at getting to that point and now more often that not I think "ahh - almost there" and as you say it kills the moment and brings back some sensory awareness and you need to start again

ZEO sleep recorder?
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Re: is there an easer way to do deep

Postby Majic » Wed Apr 17, 2013 2:51 pm

ZEO sleep recorder?

Monitor, recorder... yes have done on and off for a couple of years
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Re: is there an easer way to do deep

Postby Xanth » Wed Apr 17, 2013 3:16 pm

Majic wrote:ZEO sleep recorder?

Monitor, recorder... yes have done on and off for a couple of years

Is this something that's free?
Cheap to buy? :)

Maybe add a post about it to the Tools section? Might be interesting!
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Re: is there an easer way to do deep

Postby Majic » Wed Apr 17, 2013 4:30 pm

will do, I thought you used them
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