Etheric Projection vs Astral Projection

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Etheric Projection vs Astral Projection

Postby Xanth » Thu Aug 08, 2013 8:39 pm

From my own experiences and what I’ve researched there isn’t enough evidence that exists from either that dictates there there are these separate “planes” of existence.

From my own experiences, I’ve experienced realities that looked very similar to this physical reality, including areas which I mostly recognize… and I’ve had experiences in realities which are nothing like this physical reality nor are anywhere I recognize.

I surmise from this that what people label as an “etheric” projection is a projection where they are in a non-physical environment that they recognize to be this physical reality… when it’s very strongly possible that all they’re experiencing is a non-physical environment heavily modified by their own consciousness.

See, I believe that people are interpreting their experiences too literal. Robert Monroe did this at first and while it “seemed” like it was correct at the time, he later figured out by his third book that what he was experiencing could not be taking literal. Just like you can’t take a dream and interpret it based upon the literal translation of what you’ve seen/experienced.

So, back to the “etheric” projection… I think it’s strongly supported by the many reports that I’ve read and what I’ve directly experienced myself that reality works much in the same way it does while physically awake/aware. We each experience a non-physical reality (consensus probably) and we each interact with that reality on an interpretational level, meaning that what we experience we must interpret first in order to experience it. While we’re doing this through our projection, we’re not only interpreting our own experience, but other consciousnesses in the “area” (quoted because it’s loosely meant) are also creating and pushing their creations upon others as well… this is why I believe we get reality fluctuations. The further away from the more familiar places we get (ie: our bedroom, house or street) then the more reality fluctuations kick in. Simply put, the source of them is from other consciousnesses working against your own creations.

Going back to the original question… is there a difference between etheric and astral projections, I say only if you believe there is. I don’t think there is any objective evidence out there that supports the existence of different planes. I believe it all comes down to personal interpretation of the experience and what that particular person has experienced or read about previously.

Comments? Thoughts? Ideas? Perspectives? :)
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Etheric Projection vs Astral Projection

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Re: Etheric Projection vs APstral Projection

Postby CFTraveler » Fri Aug 09, 2013 9:58 am

Please tell me what the purpose of this post is- other than discrediting those who think there is a difference that is more than perceptual.
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Re: Etheric Projection vs Astral Projection

Postby Xanth » Fri Aug 09, 2013 10:58 am

The purpose was to share my perspective on the subject and perhaps drive some discussion. I don't mean anything more than that, CFT. :)

I'd love to hear everyone else's perspective on the subject too!
I know everyone here is very respectful and I think we could get drive some great discussion on this particular subject... it seems to be a very strong dividing line in the community.
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Re: Etheric Projection vs Astral Projection

Postby Sinera » Fri Aug 09, 2013 2:08 pm

I'd like to link this thread I made a while ago on the Pulse instead of repeating it all again here:
Etheric Projections (Astral Pulse)

It is also vital to not just read my experience but the experiences and analysis of user "todd421757" who is an experienced "etheric" projector, but unfortunately left for whatever reason (ideological???) the forum.

I agree with everything he says from MY OWN experience.

Kundalini is real. Very real. Many people experience some part of it or entirely, independently of each other.

Energy sensations such as e.g. chakra warming/pulsing or vibrations are real. All energy sensations seem to be more tied to the focus/plane/level that is commonly called "etheric". My CAVE-Method (Clairaudient Astral Void Experience) seems to also 'take place' on this level since I use a "physical" sense (seemingly) with "real" hearing while I'm in a kind of in-between physical-astral-trance state communicating with "someone" reasonably. It worked well - at least for a while.

I know that you only "phase" and do not have these sensations. That is okay. You lack the experience in this area. And you don't need it, of course. It's okay. Why should you. You're a great experiencer with phasing and don't need it.

But why do you BELIEVE ;) that they cannot be "real" since they do not belong to your "reality"? If I tell you that sth exists that I saw and experienced and others experience it too, then it has a common ground in reality - it's part of the "Consensus reality". Energy sensations and "etheric" experience might be part of a ruleset of a reality, or whatever.

Example by analogy: Would you disbelieve that the Eiffel Tower in Paris exists just because you were not there in person with your physical body and touched it's walls? Even if thousands of people tell you so and you can read about it or view pics on tv, internet, books, mags, history books, etc.?

So does "belief" create the Eiffel Tower? No. I do not think so, neither does it create the "etheric" experience. I can attest to that also from my own experience. I have even personal proof:

I did not even know what Kundalini waves are when I experienced them. I assure that I did not even know the word "Kundalini" back then!!! :lol:

This proves to me that it is not belief or expectation. It is a reality. Thus the theory is incorrect.

Please don't try to make your own experiences the only basis for reality, it does not work this way. I know that many say that we all create our own reality, to some degree it is true, but I believe there is an overarching ruleset for each reality with mechanisms of transport, interaction, communication etc. And etheric "sensations" and experiences could well be part of that ruleset - possibly between "astral" and "physical" rulesets? Or as a kind transit zone. Maybe it's a ruleset of how the different planes or focus levels interact with each other.
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Re: Etheric Projection vs Astral Projection

Postby CFTraveler » Fri Aug 09, 2013 6:09 pm

I used to have etheric projections all the time, now I phase. Sometimes I have the ocassional symptom, but maybe once a year or less often.
I don't have an opinion on 'what' they are, but the experience is very different, and in cases, verifiable.
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Re: Etheric Projection vs Astral Projection

Postby Xanth » Fri Aug 09, 2013 7:51 pm

CFTraveler wrote:I used to have etheric projections all the time, now I phase. Sometimes I have the ocassional symptom, but maybe once a year or less often.
I don't have an opinion on 'what' they are, but the experience is very different, and in cases, verifiable.

But in your experiences, you label it as an "etheric" projection, right?
Why do you label it as such?
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Re: Etheric Projection vs Astral Projection

Postby CFTraveler » Fri Aug 09, 2013 10:54 pm

No, I label it as 'realtime' projection. Etheric has too many connotations regarding Greek mythology and medieval science. I like the term, but not for the projection experience.
I label it as 'realtime' because it's descriptive of what it looks like, even though the feeling (tactile) information isn't 'solid', there is a heftiness to the textures that make them 'like real', or 'my house'.

ps. When I use 'etheric' I do it because it's better known and most of the time, especially with spanish-speaking projectors, I'm instantly understood.
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Re: Etheric Projection vs Astral Projection

Postby Xanth » Fri Aug 09, 2013 11:14 pm

CFTraveler wrote:No, I label it as 'realtime' projection. Etheric has too many connotations regarding Greek mythology and medieval science. I like the term, but not for the projection experience.
I label it as 'realtime' because it's descriptive of what it looks like, even though the feeling (tactile) information isn't 'solid', there is a heftiness to the textures that make them 'like real', or 'my house'.

ps. When I use 'etheric' I do it because it's better known and most of the time, especially with spanish-speaking projectors, I'm instantly understood.

hehe Understood. :)
I agree completely that some words tend to be waaaaaay too "loaded" or with too much baggage attached to them.
I really try to stay away from those as well if I can.

I didn't realize the spanish-speaking community related to "etheric" better. Interesting.

How do you account for reality fluctuations?
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Re: Etheric Projection vs Astral Projection

Postby Sandalwood » Sat Aug 10, 2013 9:35 am

ethereal and astral are different words for the same thing.
as a subtle body, you are nolonger limited by time or space, so you experience very different places
sometimes you experience worlds very different from this once, sometimes somewhere very much alike this, and sometimes you experience this same world though it could be somewhere youre not familiar with or even at a different time.
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Re: Etheric Projection vs Astral Projection

Postby Xanth » Sat Aug 10, 2013 9:39 am

Sandalwood wrote:ethereal and astral are different words for the same thing.
as a subtle body, you are nolonger limited by time or space, so you experience very different places
sometimes you experience worlds very different from this once, sometimes somewhere very much alike this, and sometimes you experience this same world though it could be somewhere youre not familiar with or even at a different time.

So, as with myself, you believe that the different terms that most people use to describe these "planes" are really describing the same thing? :)
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Re: Etheric Projection vs Astral Projection

Postby astralzombie » Sat Aug 10, 2013 10:06 am

I did not even know what Kundalini waves are when I experienced them. I assure that I did not even know the word "Kundalini" back then!!! :lol:


I remember getting into a discussion with you on the Pulse about Kundalini as well. I have never discredited the validity of it being real, I only felt that many people were confusing it with panic attacks because the symptoms mirror each other.

With that said, I have since come to learn (I always suspected as well as Lionheart) that a great many of the people who practice meditation and yoga, do so because they suffered from panic attacks first. IMO, these people are in a position to clearly know the difference in the sensations. This is a clear indication to me that they are two different experiences although there may still be a link.

So, as with myself, you believe that the different terms that most people use to describe these "planes" are really describing the same thing?


I have never scene any evidence in my explorations that suggest different planes or realms although I am a firm believer in dimensions.
Last edited by astralzombie on Sat Aug 10, 2013 11:02 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Etheric Projection vs Astral Projection

Postby Xanth » Sat Aug 10, 2013 8:00 pm

Lionheart wrote:I haven't had enough experiences to be able to discern what really is going on. Just when I think I know something, it changes.

Ask me again in 20 years, lol! ;)

Cop out!! ;)

You must have some kind of idea by now... or formed some kind of preliminary suggestion upon it. :)
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Re: Etheric Projection vs Astral Projection

Postby wstein » Sat Aug 10, 2013 8:56 pm

Xanth wrote: From my own experiences and what I’ve researched there isn’t enough evidence that exists from either that dictates there there are these separate “planes” of existence.
All reality is connected. As such, nothing is completely separate. Planes, realms, dimensions are conceptual divisions (within consciousness) based on the observation that ‘large’ pieces of reality seem to be all of the same nature. For instance on the Material Plane (where Earth is) it all seems to play by a singular set of natural ‘laws’. Each of the Astral Planes have their own set of ‘laws of nature’ each distinct and consistent. In between the planes is continuous, at some point the nature changes it character. Vast areas or reality are pretty formless lacking any character. The ‘places’ of note are ‘far’ apart typically.

Xanth wrote: From my own experiences, I’ve experienced realities that looked very similar to this physical reality, including areas which I mostly recognize… and I’ve had experiences in realities which are nothing like this physical reality nor are anywhere I recognize.
You need to go ‘farther’. I quite assure you that ‘out’ there things begin to look quite different. And ‘way out’ there things are barely recognizable. Having been way out there, pretty much every attribute you attribute to ‘physical reality’ is just a ‘local’ phenomena. ‘We’ being beings from a coherent part of reality, we tend to seek other such places to visit. If you have some ability to OBE, go to the area between ‘planes’ and make a ‘sharp turn’ (rather than continue to the next plane). There is plenty of different out there…

Xanth wrote: I surmise from this that what people label as an “etheric” projection is a projection where they are in a non-physical environment that they recognize to be this physical reality… when it’s very strongly possible that all they’re experiencing is a non-physical environment heavily modified by their own consciousness.
The different types of projection are not about where you can go or the nature of those destinations. Most forms allow one to go the same places, though certain places may be easier to access depending on the form. The OBE forms are distinguished by what assets or attributes one ‘takes’ with them. In Astral Projection, one takes duplicates of awareness, consciousness, and the ethereal body. In mental projection one takes a duplicate awareness and some energy capability, consciousness stays with your body.

Xanth wrote: See, I believe that people are interpreting their experiences too literal. Robert Monroe did this at first and while it “seemed” like it was correct at the time, he later figured out by his third book that what he was experiencing could not be taking literal. Just like you can’t take a dream and interpret it based upon the literal translation of what you’ve seen/experienced.
Especially when one starts going to places very unlike the material plane, the brain which stores your readily accessible memories has no way to represent the actual experience. So basically it stores a representational story about the experience. Same is true any time one uses their ‘extra senses’,
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Re: Etheric Projection vs Astral Projection

Postby astralzombie » Sat Aug 10, 2013 11:16 pm

To me, it comes down to individual beliefs and biases. So long as we have a physical body, we bring both along for every astral ride.

If someone has no idea that there is a belief that the astral is divided in to planes, their projections will not reflect that. I've always preferred the term OOBE because of all the heavy beliefs that come along with AP that aren't mine to begin with. I may come to see much of it the same and thus form a similar belief but that, to me, is much better than learning the concept of someone else and then trying to see what they see. It constricts any objectiveness out of what is already a highly subjective study.

If there is any objectivity in this at all, it can only come from a consensus reached from different perspectives at it's start. :)
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Re: Etheric Projection vs Astral Projection

Postby CFTraveler » Sun Aug 11, 2013 10:48 am

How do you account for reality fluctuations?
I don't because I don't have to. If we create our experience based on our experience (as in, feedback) and out creative ability, we can superimpose any structure our subconscious feels like manifesting. But when I see a butterfly in the real time zone and then I wake up, go to the place I saw it and there it is, I can't say that I created that.

I don't really know what the problem is with naming an area of perception what it looks like. Descriptive terms are self-explanatory, and easy to understand. Whether it's all the same is irrelevant, because in my view, all of reality, be it physical or nonphysical, is self created anyway.
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Re: Etheric Projection vs Astral Projection

Postby wstein » Mon Aug 12, 2013 12:55 am

astralzombie wrote: If someone has no idea that there is a belief that the astral is divided in to planes, their projections will not reflect that.
I don't agree. If one goes to an unknown place, there are no pre-beliefs about what will be there. From my roaming outside particular 'planes', I saw a landscape of sorts made from the varying nature of different 'regions'. Its analogous to flying high above the Earth, its pretty clear there are different terrains (sea, forest, marsh, desert, mountains). While there is no absolute distinction between these regions, its very natural to 'identify' and 'label' areas of similarity. This of course is mostly a convenience for your mind/consciousness rather than any reflection on actuality. Unless the whole thing is just imagination or delusion, the patches labeled as planes do represent something more actual than 'belief'. Perhaps not everyone will perceive the regions of similarity in the same way so some might identify a different number of 'astral planes'. A fine point is that those with 'blocking' beliefs may not perceive all of what is there. If extreme cases, they might not even see anything.
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Re: Etheric Projection vs Astral Projection

Postby Sandalwood » Mon Aug 12, 2013 1:35 pm

Xanth wrote: So, as with myself, you believe that the different terms that most people use to describe these "planes" are really describing the same thing? :)

existence is a spectrum, from yang to yin, physical to consciousness. between the material and immaterial is a middle area. this is astral, ethereal, subtle body, soul. each of these are a series a planes, its a spectrum. they may have different sorts of experiences, but theyre a subtle body experience, so they exist beyond the body and before the lack of form, in this ethereal area.
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Re: Etheric Projection vs Astral Projection

Postby astralzombie » Tue Aug 13, 2013 11:00 pm

wstein wrote:
astralzombie wrote: If someone has no idea that there is a belief that the astral is divided in to planes, their projections will not reflect that.
I don't agree. If one goes to an unknown place, there are no pre-beliefs about what will be there. From my roaming outside particular 'planes', I saw a landscape of sorts made from the varying nature of different 'regions'. Its analogous to flying high above the Earth, its pretty clear there are different terrains (sea, forest, marsh, desert, mountains). While there is no absolute distinction between these regions, its very natural to 'identify' and 'label' areas of similarity. This of course is mostly a convenience for your mind/consciousness rather than any reflection on actuality. Unless the whole thing is just imagination or delusion, the patches labeled as planes do represent something more actual than 'belief'. Perhaps not everyone will perceive the regions of similarity in the same way so some might identify a different number of 'astral planes'. A fine point is that those with 'blocking' beliefs may not perceive all of what is there. If extreme cases, they might not even see anything.


I see what you are saying. My quote would have been more accurate if I had said "....their projections may not reflect that."

Because that was definitely the case with me. I had my first spontaneous OOBE almost 14 years ago. I was a devout Catholic at the time and for me to take an active interest in AP was the same as telling the devil "Hi, here's my soul, you want it?" in the eyes of the church.

But I HAD to know what was happening so I dropped the AP term so it didn't carry any mystic baggage and so forth. Anyways I found ONE technique, tried it for a month or so and succeeded. For many years, I did not read a single book on the subject so I had no idea what others consider the astral to be composed of. So my projections never once reflected the plane theory. Even now that I have read up on the experiences of others and the different beliefs associated with it, I still do not see planes and such.

I get around quite well and have no problem going to more positive areas but I have never once thought about "raising my vibrations and such. I just never knew that others felt that it was necessary so it had no influence on me. Does this make any sense senor? :)

But you make an excellent point. BTW, wstein, I really enjoy your posts and thank you have a great deal to offer. It would be nice if you made an introduction and told us a bit about yourself. Just an idea, no biggie if you don't.
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Re: Etheric Projection vs Astral Projection

Postby wstein » Wed Aug 14, 2013 12:53 am

astralzombie wrote: I get around quite well and have no problem going to more positive areas but I have never once thought about "raising my vibrations and such. I just never knew that others felt that it was necessary so it had no influence on me. Does this make any sense senor? :)
Yes, makes sense to me.

I too learned to OBE without any knowledge either of how to do it nor what I might find. Most of my exploration was very targeted at finding out specific things that I wanted to know (who created this universe, what is at the edge of this universe, what are my other incarnations doing, how does one do telekinesis, etc). As such I didn't/don't pay too much attention to which plane I might be on. For the most part I have not been anywhere that others (on Earth) have been (except for joint OBE excursions). From wandering in the space 'between' I learned that the texture I perceive indicates if there might be something interesting to 'see'. Areas with lots of 'texture' have stuff going on and areas that appear 'thin and gray' are always stark with little happening. Its not different than looking up at the sky, not much going on in the 'black' parts, lots in the areas with light and color. Doesn't matter if you 'label' the lights as stars, nebulae, planets, etc or not.
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Re: Etheric Projection vs Astral Projection

Postby Szaxx » Sat Aug 17, 2013 3:01 am

Taking a perspective view from as innocent as one can be. At 4 years of age I travelled around my local area at night. Always a thought to do this started the excursion.
Everything was a perfect match to the physical on almost all occasions.
The differences I found were not known until I looked outside in the morning. One particular occasion a tree was damaged in a storm, the top section damaged left it lying at an angle. I flew around this and remembered it. In the morning I told my father about this oddity. He smiled and lifted me up to the window. I saw a replica of what I had told him from the experience.
Other times I took my brother on outings to my grandparents house. We walked through the fields and found new plants and bushes on arrival. He doesn't remember much as it was in the 60's and he is younger.
Astral or etheric made no sense at all. No books on the subject could be read or any help given at any time. It was and still is real as perceived.
Since that time, the progress made knows no boundaries. From that apparent solidity to places of pure thought and white light only, seeing future events and more, I'll take things as percieved, the scrutiny can be applied later..
As we are now doing.
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